Rhythm and Organizing
Enrico Piras asked a very thought-provoking question on the Aacorn listserv. I’ve taken the liberty of posting his question and the various responses (up to November 11, 2006). I’m hoping to see even more–it’s one of those things I’ve wondered about for a long time. Daved
“Dear Acorners,
I’m right in the middle of writing a book section on an aesthetic perspective on workgroup cohesion.
The key concept in my analysis will be “rhythm”, which I will use to explore how micropractices are built. So far in my literature review I haven’t found many references. I mean, many articles and authors use the word “rhythm” but only on an evocative level and there seems to be not much theory attached to this word. At the moment I’m referring to some reflections on art and especially music. I’d like to find out how this concept has been used in organizational theory.
I’m sure some of you has come across this concept or something similar to it in your research.
Could you help?
best
Enrico”
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From: Daved Barry [mailto:dbarry@fe.unl.pt]
Sent: Friday, 10 November 2006 1:52 a.m.
Ralph (Bathurst) and Lloyd (Williams)—didn’t we talk about this at Krakow? Seems to me there were some rhythm discussions there. Anyway, in addition to the work that Ralph Kerle suggested, you should look at Cadences at Waco: A critique of “Timing and Music” by Stuart Albert and Geoffrey Bell (2002) Academy of Management Review, 27(4): 574–593. (as well as the original Albert and Bell piece). They really started the whole idea of rhythm and organization and are the only ones I know who’ve gotten very far with the concept. Hope this helps! Daved
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Hi Enrico
Yes we have spent time talking about this issue. Our critique of Albert and Bell was fairly muted. Our reserve about their analysis was based on the notion that musical rhythm is much more complex than A & B indicated. The trouble is that it requires much more sophisticated musical knowledge to tease out those complexities.
It seems to me that to do this within the organisational studies discipline is going to involve devising a language that retains musicological integrity while at the same time is accessible to non-musicians.
For instance even defining rhythm is tricky. We could think of it at the level of pulse (or beat) which is where A & B focus, or we could go deeper and think of elements like harmonic rhythm which are more complex but much more interesting. Our critique of A & B signalled this latter notion of harmonic rhythm but this is where musical knowledge is crucial.
I am happy to engage in conversation about this with you and other interested people if you want.Cheers
Ralph (Bathurst)
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From: Enrico Maria Piras
Hi Dav*d,
I did not know the reference, and it’s fantastic to see how the aacorn network works so much efficiently than any search engine I’ve used so far.
thanks,
e.
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From: Ken Parry
I take students through the rhythm (and riff) vis-à-vis the lyrics of music, then ask them to tell me what might be the rhythm and lyrics of an organisation.Here is some of what they tell me:
Rhythm is culture. Lyrics are policy statements
Rhythm is action. Lyrics are talk
Lyrics are policies and strategic plans. Rhythm is the emotion that they generate
Lyrics are the message. Rhythm is the vehicle
Rhythm is inspiration-vision. Lyrics are mission
Lyrics are the agenda. Rhythm is how I run the meeting
There are many more, and an article in there somewhere. Thank you for the article citations. Cheers,
Ken.
Ken Parry
Griffith Business School
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From: Ralph Kerle I have always worked with rhythm in whatever corporate or organizational cultural programming, meeting or communication I have been involved in creating and producing regardless of length of time - minutes, hours, days or months - sometimes years!!!There is an internal rhythm that accompanies each piece/sequence/stanza – a rush today, a pause for two weeks as the rhythm moves to another field, another place, another moment… perhaps another instrument of production!!!There is a returning to the original theme or stream within the piece and a new rhythm kicks in….This internal rhythm is recognized instantly by those who work in or are experienced in project management. They very much understand the notion of organizational rhythm!And I think there is always a structure to this internal rhythmFor example, ever organizational communication has to have an opening – the curtain goes up…
“another opening…
another show….
another meeting
here we go…”
and this applies equally to a moment or to an event for 10,000 delegates…And to sustain this momentum, this rhythm, each communication/sequence/act - verbal, kinaesthetic or multi-media or all of these media combined has to have a series of movements/sequences that build a sense - a completeness of the circle of a sense of communication if you will… The concern here is how should each act be placed to recognize and establish the rhythm…. Editors know. So does an audience intuitively know. You can see people twitching and fiddling because the meeting, the presentation has gone too long…the presenter has not been in touch with the internal rhythm of the medium or language used to communicateIn this ever evolving rhythm of sense making, there has to be intervals…reprises. There has to be a FINALE before the music starts all over again…..I hope this contributes to this fascinating discourse. I would love to enter into a dialogue around this topic with anybody….it has an endless fascination for me both theoretical and as a prime driver in my work as an artist/producer working primarily in the live medium…The rhythm is the internal heart beat of all creative work!!!Ralphralph kerle
chief executive officer
the creative leadership forum
100 mowbray road,
willoughby. nsw australia 2068
p 612 9967 8611
m 612 (0)412 559 603
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From David Weir
Sent: Friday, November 10, 2006 9:14 AM
To: AACORN@JISCMAIL.AC.UK
Subject: Re: call for help_rhythm and organizing-
Hi guys;
Here are some questions that bother me. For example, do different cultures have different rhythms? Do different organisation structures? Different occupational systems? How do we study this?
If different musics embody different accounts of time!space, why is this? How are these rhythms transmitted? Are different cognitive structures involved?
Why is Jimmy Giuffre’s “Train and the River” about a train and a river? How is Takemitsu about “the thing we call Time”?
Please answer within one hour as we are discussing this topic right now in class.
Thanks to all.
Rock On, Dudes!
David
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From: Nicoline Jacoby Petersen
I’m working on designing new conference formats, and some months ago I put RHYTHM to my list of design principles - so I find this discussion very interesting! I haven’t explored the concept that much yet (thanks for the references!), but I found rhythm relevant for my work for several reasons: I’ve been looking into attention psychology, and it seems that the body runs in two hour cycles regarding attention: humans switch between being introvert attentive and extrovert attentive during a day (I don’t know if these are the right words in English). So to me, rhythm (or: a good rhythm) can also be conceived in terms of accommodating bodily needs during a conference day, if that makes sense 
Next, I think that variation is a key to keeping attention, and again rhythm offers a good way of thinking along these lines (introducing A, repeating A, breaking the routine by introducing B, and repeating A again - which also breaks the routine, yet is familiar to the audience). Finally there is something about rhythm and timing/planning. In a conference setting, the perceived time is often very different from real time - time can fly by and time can stand still. It can be difficult to plan that all speeches for example should only last 30 minutes - since some speeches will be perceived as lasting 10 minutes and some as hours. So you want to make sure that the rhythm is in alignment with the perceived time - and how do you plan that?!
Just a few thoughts - which of course doesn’t answer David’s interesting question about cultural differences in rhythms… Haven’t thought of that, but sure will do
Cheers,
Nicoline
Nicoline Jacoby Petersen // PhD student
www.dpu.dk/about/njp LEARNING LAB DENMARK
The Danish University of Education
Emdrupvej 101
2400 Copenhagen NV
Denmarkemail: njp.lld@dpu.dk
phone: (+45) 8888 9983
mobile: (+45) 606 505 44
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From David Atkinson
Sent: Friday, November 10, 2006 1:46 PM
This is a very interesting discussion thread on rhythm and organising. At the risk of clouding the issue, and - as a newcomer to AACORN - my apologies in advance if I do, I offer the following muse.
As a metaphor I see rhythm as yet another powerful method of unpicking what might appear to be good (or bad) about this or that management and/or organisational performance; in order that certain performances might be better replicated. This would, I believe, follow Argyris’s Model I concept of organisational management learning.
Do we then look for managers who have “natural” rhythm when we lack a blue print for organisational action? This might, for example, be within complex and ambiguous situations.
While we might teach dance routines or the techniques for playing a certain instrument, can we teach “performance with rhythm”? Here, I believe, we enter the realm of whether or not, or to what extent, can an organisational manager be deemed an artist and whether or not, or to what extent the organization itself might be considered a work of art? If management/organisation seen as an art-form is management/organisation with rhythm this might a freedom of expression that is to be welcomed/championed and celebrated in some circumstances and context but in others possibly to be seen as a threat to organization stability.
For example, self-learning organisations implicitly suggest an inherent “rhythm generation capability” - what might this be? What we, as Western “organisers”, would class as a rhythmic ideal would not easily match with our Eastern counterparts.To my mind, rhythm presents itself as yet another concept fascinating in its intricacy and a powerful metaphor but, at least on the face of it, offering perhaps little within itself to indicate any transcendent purpose. If that makes sense.
Over to you all again!
Cheers
David
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From Ralph Kerle
Sent: Friday, November 10, 2006 8:51 PM
Hi folks;See answers after each question Here are some questions that bother me. For example, do different cultures have different rhythms?
Yes See Grateful Dead drummer Mickey Hart’s book on the the cultural and musical differences in percussive rhythms - great read even straight!!
Do different organisation structures?
Yes take a quick look at the emergence of digital economies..and then a long slow stroll through the complete works of the Harvard Business School and every other business school around the world…there must be something in it!!
Different occupational systems?
Yes - Look at an operating theatre as opposed to a prison…slightly different rhythm - I suspect one is “harder” than the other…
If different musics embody different accounts of time and space, why is this?
Language, culture and theory - sound, image and text…the elder showed it to me…
How are these rhythms transmitted?
Through tacit knowledge, experience and email.
Are different cognitive structures involved?
No! It’s very pure - it’s built around the heart beat! Why is Jimmy Giuffre’s “Train and the River” about a train and a river?I think you are confused here -you really are referring to that great Hammond organ player of the 60’s and 70’s, Jimmy McGriff who wrote “Hear Comes The Train” whilst floating slowly down the Mississippi to New Orleans on a showboat … “Hear Comes The Train” maybe downloadable from one of those illegal European P2P music sites that carry more free downloads than Napster ever did..How is Takemitsu about “the thing we call Time”?Both begin with “T”????
Please answer within one hour as we are discussing this topic right now in class I am on standby, please keep the questions rolling in…
Thanks to all.
Rock On,Dudes!
David
Rhythmic Ralph or R&R…….
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From Grace Ann Rosile
Sent: Friday, November 10, 2006 9:16 PM
Each gait of a horse has its own rhythm.
Each horse has its own natural rhythm within that gait.
Not all horses can perform all gaits; some are unique to a breed.
In dressage, when you want to do a musical kur
which is riding in a pattern to music, you need to either
watch the horse or watch a video of the horse while
listening to the music, to see which music best fits that
horse’s rhythm.
When jumping, the jump is best taken if the approach is rhythmical,
which can require the horse and/or rider to rate the speed /length of
stride in the approach to the jump so that it comes out right.
I have read somewhere that the fastest race horses are those
for whom each step in their galloping is the most evenly spaced.
Personally, when doing physical labor (i.e. shoveling manure)
when the body finds a rhythm the work seems less effortful.
Just a few thoughts from the world of horses–
Grace Ann
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From Bathurst, Ralph
Sent: Friday, November 10, 2006 10:00 PM
Hi Folks
Two theoretical things come to mind that might help integrate notions of rhythm with managing particular tasks.
First, Ingarden distinguishes between temporality and supratemporality. For him temporality is lineal time with its daily rhythms of sunrise, sunset, seasons and our rhythmic interactions within this large sense of time. Supratemporality, though, is time within time. Hence a musical work with its own rhythms exists in time but outside of linear time (therefore being supratemporal). Ingarden writes of music as having ‘an internal, immanent, quasi-temporal structure.’ So when we think of rhythm and timing, I think we need to consider which dimension we are working within – the long line of temporality or time within time. Ingarden, R. (1986). The work of music and the problem of its identity (A. Czerniawski, Trans.). London: Macmillan.
Second is the notion of consonance and dissonance that Daved Barry and Lloyd Williams and I have been playing around with. Within a musical piece yes there is beats or pulses that conspire to form an overall sense of rhythm. However, there is also a deeper sense of rhythm that underlies the toe-tapping sense of certainty. In music, this underlying rhythm is set up by the continual oscillation between dissonance and consonance (intense harmonic chaos alternating with calm repose). It is this oscillation between dissonance and consonance that gives music its deeper sense of forward movement. Therefore Daved, Lloyd and I have pondered on how dissent, conflict, chaos within organisational life are elements to be cherished and somehow encouraged in order to achieve a sense of rhythm (movement).
Cheers
Ralph
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From David Weir
Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2006 9:58 AM
Hi Ralph;
very helpful. I shall think and then respond.
But Jimmy Giuffre really is Jimmy Giuffre.
See –http://www.retards.org/library/music/jazz/giuffre/
And Remember the Newport Festival album (1957?) Jazz on a summers Day.
Iconic listening for me and mine in the days when the future seemed simpler…
All best
David
